Minutes

26 June 2001

Minutes of the meeting of the Consultation, Diversity and Outreach Committee held at the St. Edward's Comprehensive School, London Road, Romford RM7 9NX.

Present

Members

• R. David Muir (Chair)
• Cindy Butts (Deputy Chair)
• Jennette Arnold
• Jennifer Jones
• Nicholas Long
• Cecile Lothian
• Angela Slaven

MPA staff

• Catherine Crawford (Clerk)
• Julia Smith (Policy Officer, CDO)
• John Crompton (Secretariat)

MPS staff

• Tim Godwin (Deputy Assistant Commissioner)
• Steve Lovelock
• Steve Roberts
• Les Owen (Borough Commander, Havering)

In addition approximately thirty members of the press/public and other Metropolitan Police Authority (MPA)/Metropolitan Police Service (MPS) staff were present.

Part 1

116. Apologies

(Agenda item 1)

Apologies for absence were received from Abdal Ullah (Deputy Chair, CDO), and from John Cryer and Angela Watson two of the local Members of Parliament.

117. Minutes of the meeting - 22 May 2001

(Agenda item 2)

Resolved: That the minutes of the meeting held on the 22 May 2001 be agreed and signed as a correct record.

Arising-

Cecile Lothian referred to an earlier meeting at which a report on appointing members to a working group to progress the Authority's responsibilities under the Race Relations (Amendment) Act 2000 had been considered. She asked what progress had been made in appointing members to the working group.

The Policy Officer, CDO explained that a date for the first meeting of the group had been set and committee Chairs had been asked to nominate members.

118. Chair and Link Members' update.

(Agenda item 3)

The Chair reported on several current issues relating to the work of the Committee. These included:

The Virdi Inquiry – it was envisaged that a report would be submitted to the Authority at its meeting in July.

Murder of Damilola Taylor – four young people had been arrested in connection with this murder enquiry and the Chair had maintained contact with the Taylor family.

Committee Members spoke individually about their MPA work during the last month. Jenny Jones reported that she was continuing her work around road safety issues and openness and accountability within the MPS. Nicholas Long spoke of his finance work as Deputy Chair of the Finance Planning and Best Value Committee and of several visits he had made, in his capacity as Chair of the Estates Sub-Group to MPS premises as part of an assessment of the state of locker rooms, WCs and shower facilities. Angela Slaven had been involved with work on the Virdi inquiry. Cecile Lothian had visited trainee police officers in Lewisham and had attended a conference about MPA relations with the media. Cindy Butts had attended various meetings including one in connection with the Notting Hill Carnival and a CDO diversity strategy workshop.

Resolved: That the Chair and members' update be noted.

119. Questions from the public

(Agenda item 4)

The comments, questions and replies are contained on Appendix 1 of the minutes.

120. MPS youth offending initiatives and working with young people

(Agenda item 5)

The Committee received a report outlining the many initiatives the MPS are involved with in working with young people to prevent offending behaviour and to steer young offenders away from crime.

The Committee agreed that there is a need to work closely with young people in order to identify possible solutions to offending behaviour and welcomed the multi agency approach that has been adopted by the Youth Offending Teams. The Committee noted the high level of importance the MPS attaches to this issue and agreed that whilst the measures outlined in the report are welcome they are by no means a solution and that more work, including working with young people in identifying solutions, needs to be done to address this issue.

Resolved: That the report be noted.

121. Stop and Search – interim response to APA

(Agenda item 6)

Details were submitted of the officer response, which had been submitted to the Association of Police Authorities (APA) based on the consultation undertaken to gain the views of the public on recommendation 61 of the Stephen Lawrence Inquiry Report, proposing that the police should be required to give a record to an individual when they have been stopped. All the groups consulted, except police officers, supported the recommendation. Initial analysis of the questionnaires completed by almost 600 individuals also indicates support for the implementation of the recommendation.

In reply to a point raised by a Member, the Policy Officer CDO confirmed that the audiotapes that had been made of the consultation meetings with young people would be transcribed and could be sent to the Home Office. With the consent of all those involved, a video recording had been made of the police stops conference and one meeting involving young people in south London.

Resolved: That

1. the interim response which had been submitted to the APA be noted;
2. the process for dealing with the emerging outcome of the report be agreed; and
3. a small working group of key stakeholders be established to be responsible for giving guidance on the further stages of the development of all aspects of this project, including proposals for the implementation action plan.

122. Stop and Search – information campaign

(Agenda item 7)

A report was submitted which updated the Committee on the Authority's public information campaign to increase public awareness of the individual's rights with regard to stop and search.

In reply to a question, the Clerk confirmed that a cap had been put on the spending on the campaign and it was therefore expected that there would be no costs in following years.

Resolved: That the report be noted.

123. Recommendation 61 consultation with children

(Agenda item 8)

As part of the consultation with London's communities on the feasibility and desirability of implementing Recommendation 61 of the report of the Stephen Lawrence Inquiry, the Authority undertook a consultation exercise with children at the 'Big Meeting' that was organised by the Office of the Children's Rights Commissioner.

In introducing the report, the Clerk said that the Policy Officer CDO and her colleagues should be thanked for their hard working in setting up the conference.

Resolved: That

1. the publication and distribution of the specially designed stop and search consultation questionnaire, which was used with the children, be noted.

2. the potential financial implications of further consultation with children and other 'hard to reach groups' be noted.

124. Presentation by NSPCC – building safer communities for children

(Agenda item 9)

Jason Lane and Jackie Hall from the regional office of the NSPCC gave a presentation on the work of the NSPCC and outlined three pilot projects (Neighbourhood Projects, Childwatch and SCRAP) that focussed on children and young people as the potential victims of crime and as people who had a fear of crime. So far, none of these pilots had been run in London.

Copies of an NSPCC report entitled "Building Safer Communities for Children were circulated to Members. This is a child-focussed analysis of Crime and Disorder Strategies.

The Committee noted that NSPCC would be contacting the MPA and MPS in the future to discuss ways of carrying forward their work in London.

125. Independent custody visiting – progress report

(Agenda item 10)

The Committee received a summary of the activities undertaken to progress the work on independent custody visiting.

It was noted that recommendation 2 should be amended by the addition of the phrase 'be circulated to all members of the CDO Committee and the ICV panels' before the word 'reports'

Resolved: That

1. it be noted that the 'Questionnaire Response' and 'Questionnaire Analysis' reports will be considered by the ICV lead members at their meeting on 20 July 2001;
2. following the approval of the ICV sub-group to the proposals copies of both reports be circulated to all members of the CDO Committee and the ICV panels; and
3. it be noted that there is a recommendation in the substantive report to prioritise and engage in further consultation by setting up three working groups to consult on the three identified areas where agreement is significantly low and that this be considered by the sub-group.

126. Proposed pilots to test new consultation arrangements

(Agenda item 11)

Following the agreement by the Authority to pilot new consultation arrangements to assist the MPS, the Committee received a report presenting a shortlist of the boroughs selected and a proposal for a centralised pilot resource to support other borough consultation arrangements.

Resolved: That

1. the high level of interest in boroughs that applied to take part in the MPA's pilot programme be noted;
2. the proposed shortlist of boroughs that applied to become pilots be endorsed so that officers can now commence detailed discussions for introducing the arrangements; and
3. the option of providing a centralised consultation resource to support other borough consultation be noted.

127. Facilitating pan London community and police consultative groups

(Agenda item 12)

The Authority has previously given an undertaking to support part time administrative assistance for the London wide consultative group forum in this financial year. This is a new post and potential costs associated with it were proposed for Members consideration.

Members questioned the accuracy of some of the costings shown in the options.

The Clerk advised that one possible way forward would be for the work to be undertaken by a member of MPA staff. Further information on this option would be circulated to Members.

Resolved: That

1. the proposal for the appointment of a part-time administrator for the London-wide consultative group forum and executive be endorsed on the basis that proposed working arrangements for the new post would be circulated;
2. annual meetings with Community and Policing Consultative Groups be held; and
3. the intention to fully involve CPCGs in the Authority's consultation on the annual policing priorities for 2002/03 be noted.

128. Community and race relations training

(Agenda item 13)

The Committee received a report, which summarised the progress of delivering community and race relations training in the MPS, including attendance rates at courses.

Resolved: That the report be noted.

129. Management of consultation across GLA functional bodies

(Agenda item 14)

A report was received which outlined the position regarding consultation across GLA's functional bodies and the involvement of the MPA in this consultation.

Resolved: That the report be noted.

130. CDO performance sub group

(Agenda item 15)

The Committee received a report proposing the membership of the CDO Sub Group.

Members felt that four members would probably be insufficient given the work load of the sub-group and agreed that this be reviewed.

Resolved: That

1. subject to any further members being appointed, the membership of the performance sub group be R David Muir, Cindy Butts, Abdal Ullah and Peter Herbert;
2. the terms of reference of the sub group be endorsed; and
3. the process outlined in paragraphs 6 and 7 for receiving performance data considered by the sub group be approved.

131. Race hate crimes

(Agenda item 16)

Members received a report which informed members of the outcomes of a working group meeting held on the 14 June 2001 to follow up a paper Peter Herbert had drafted following his attendance at a conference in Stockholm. It is proposed that a seminar be held later this year, which will be discussed further at the next meeting of the working group on the 23 July.

Nicholas Long stressed the importance of sources of funding being explored so that the event would, as far as possible, be self-financing.

Resolved: That the report be noted.

132. Consultation on policing plan

(Agenda item 17)

At its last meeting, the Committee endorsed a set of consultation methods to help prepare the MPA's policing and performance plan 2002/03. The Mayor subsequently indicated that detailed budget submissions must be prepared by 26 October 2001. The new deadline greatly reduces the scope for new consultation and a report was submitted which proposed revised procedures

The Clerk apologised for the fact that the paper had been circulated very late and suggested that the Committee proceed on the basis that the recommendations be considered and that Members be given a few days in which to submit any detailed comments.

Resolved - That

1. the new deadline for the budget submission and the implications for consulting with Londoners be noted; and
2. the proposed alternative arrangements be endorsed.

The meeting closed at 8.30pm

Appendix 1: Questions and comments from the public

(Agenda items 4 and 18)

In accordance with Standing Order 33, the Chair invited questions from members of the public.

At the beginning of this item, a speaker from the floor said that the use of acronyms and jargon by Members at the meeting made it difficult for the layperson to follow what was being said.

(a)In my capacity as the Chair of the local PCCG, I wrote to the MPA last October requesting a meeting to discuss future administrative arrangements. I would like to know when I will receive a reply to my letter.

The Policy Officer, CDO confirmed that a meeting would be arranged as soon as possible.

(b) Can we please be advised as to whether the Authority has formally changed the title of the consultative groups from Police and Community Consultative Group to Community and Police Consultative Group, and if so whether there was any consultation before the decision was made?

The Clerk advised that the Authority now referred to the consultative groups as Community and Police Consultative Groups but this was not prescriptive and each group was free to choose its own title.

(c) What is the MPS doing to improve cultural awareness and reduce racism within the borough?

The Borough Commander replied that the MPS had invited minority groups to attend a meeting to voice their concerns and that hate crime is monitored within the borough. Officers had also undergone race relations training during the last few months.

(d) Why was this meeting held at the same time as the Central Area Forum meeting at the town hall? Is there a lack of communication regarding public meetings? It is important that Councillors attend the CDO meetings as they have a responsibility for carrying forward any initiatives raised at the meeting. Do you invite Councillors to the meetings?

The Chair pointed out that MPA meetings were arranged several months in advance and apologised for any overlap with Council meetings. Publicity material about the CDO meetings was sent to a very large number of organisations in the community. In addition, the Authority wrote to the Chief Executive of the local authority with the details of each CDO meeting and requested that this information be made available to the borough Councillors. Individual invitation letters were sent to local Members of Parliament and the Assembly member.

(e) Does the recent resignation of Roger Evans from the MPA mean that Havering has no MPA representative?

The Chair responded by stressing that the MPA is a pan London organisation and therefore represented all Londoners. The Authority has a system whereby each Member acted as a link between one or in some cases two boroughs but this was not in a representative capacity. The Clerk confirmed that the Authority was in the process of appointing another member as the link member for Havering.

(f) What is being done to address the vandalism of bus stops in central Romford and the problem of abandoned vehicles?

DAC Godwin reported that the MPS were working in partnership with London Buses on Operation Seneca whereby buses on some routes were fitted with cameras on the outside of buses as well as the inside which enabled criminal activity at bus stops to be recorded. The police recognised that certain bus stops could be the centre of a wide range of anti social or criminal behaviour. The Borough Commander said he would be pleased to hear from the questioner after the meeting if he had any particular bus stops in mind. He also stated that abandoned vehicles were a local authority matter.

(g) Why isn't the adverse impact on residents taken into account when issuing or extending late night licenses for pubs and clubs?

Chief Superintendent Owen advised that that this was essentially a matter for the local authority. However, the police are consulted by the authority and locally the police have lodged objections to late licences for the sort of reasons the questioner had alluded to. He was anxious to work with local people so that their concerns were made known.

(h) What initiatives are being are being pursued by the MPS to deal with instances where adults with learning difficulties are harassed when travelling to and from their learning centre?

Members acknowledged that this was an area where anti social behaviour could cause great distress and it often went unreported. The Borough Commander stated that he would take this matter up following the meeting.

(i) Why had there been so many changes of Borough Commander in Havering?

The Borough Commander confirmed that he had only been in post for two months and explained that senior officers moved on for various reasons including promotion, retirement or a need for their particular skills to be deployed elsewhere.

DAC Godwin said that stability in the senior management at borough level was very important and regretted that this had not been possible in Havering in recent years. The immediate predecessor of the present Commander had been a temporary appointment but he wished to assure the meeting that the appointment of Chief Superintendent Les Owen was a permanent one.

(j) What are the MPS doing to address the problem of the theft of disability scooters?

The Borough Commander said he would speak to the questioner after the meeting.

(k) As Secretary of the local PCCG I have been asked to express concern at the fact that, as stated in agenda item 11, three of the four boroughs chosen as pilots under the Best Value Review of Consultation were inner London boroughs, as this sends out the wrong signal to the outer areas such as Havering.

Nicholas Long stressed as one of the Members involved in the selection process difficult decisions had had to be made and it was acknowledged that unsuccessful boroughs would be disappointed. Four boroughs were felt to be an appropriate number for a pilot exercise. With regard to the point about more inner boroughs having been chosen, he explained that for policing purposes Greenwich (one of the pilot boroughs) is not classified as an inner London borough.

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